How do we get 2 next level?

just a thought:

if there was more "high-authority" promotion for the leftfield dnb, it'd do better.

u can sell ice-cream to penguins if u promote and market it well.
i dare to guess that C-step / half-assed dnb sells pretty well as it's played by the A-list heads and because it's on the front page of DNB arena etc.
also, the promo sheets are displaying the DJ support by the big dudes, convincing the punters that this is good shit.

but, a good product wont sell that well with insufficient promotion.
e.g., there's this guy, Muttley, bumping "the good shit" on DOA but no1 really cares.
SC-vol-1 thread among many many others are bumped to fuck but no1 really cares.

most of the ppl need some respected figure to tell them that the stuff is hot.

what's the solution to that?

need to quote this, as an addition to my last post - well said, Bhima.

There probably is demand for it out there but maybe not everyone knows about it. Look at pop music; there's only a demand for it because it's promoted to fuck

most of the ppl need some respected figure to tell them that the stuff is hot.

what's the solution to that?

Exactly, but which respected figure's going to put his or her ass on the line to do that? A lot of the "big dogs" have their reputation to worry about and Grooverider's the most extreme example of that. The big DJs are on good wages for pleasing big crowds so why should they take risks to promote new artists and new musical concepts to a pissed up crowd who are just there to rave to some strange computer noise and 2-step (which they see as "the" dnb rhythm)???

not me

u can sell ice-cream to penguins if u promote and market it well.

penguins are far more open-minded than your average dnb fan :P

idunno, there is definitely a certain 'popness' to music that'll make it sell regardless of the market. but it's very vague and relative...got some sort of unique hook or gimmick? as long as people can sing along and they can get into it on a level where they don't use their brain, all the better if it's not contrived, and all the better if it's got some substance for when they're past their second or third listen and the brain starts sinking its teeth in. but if you're going to take things from that angle, as i have, no point in sticking around in drum and bass when it seems like there's actually more of a chance of one day selling this music our band's doing to today's technoliterate teenyboppers than there is of selling it to a thinly segmented underground audience.

my exposure far outstripped my sales. andy c playing my track and dieselboy putting it on a compilation can't have made that much difference at the end of the day. i wouldn't have minded at all if it weren't for everyone acting like it was SUPPOSED to be a gigantic deal...it's hard to keep your head down, expectations low, and build momentum at a realistic pace when you're surrounded by idealistic unrealism, you know?

it's funny, for all the criticism the role of image in music gets, it's actually quite liberating to have made our reputation at least in part on image and attitude...when you're known as the weirdos who do anything they want, you can sound like zz top one minute and justin timberlake the next and russian pirate videogame music the next and people will swallow it. yeah, you can get away with being shit in that situation, but as long as YOU keep music your first priority no matter what priority it is to others, it's one of the most beautiful things. you could deride that sort of appreciation as unpure, but i think we all get attracted to music based on superficial characteristics like that and only learn to really understand it upon repeated listenings! both heads and non-heads are into music for what looks cool and sounds cool and what people say is cool - heads just cultivate their own definition, and non-heads subscribe to somebody else's.

idunno, with the size and attitude of the dnb market, it just doesn't feel like it's worth it unless you're going to make a pop song - and if you're going to make a pop song, no need to sell it to the underground.

Actually, saying that, this scene has had big promo from people like Bailey/Flight and a knowledge mag thing too. I think that brought out Inperspective a bit more into the dnb world but it never followed through with the releases quickly enough to back up the hype. I guess "this" style has had a couple of chances to break through so hopefully it'll only be a matter of time before more hype arises.

need to quote this, as an addition to my last post - well said, Bhima.

There probably is demand for it out there but maybe not everyone knows about it. Look at pop music; there's only a demand for it because it's promoted to fuck

yeah, well that's all well and good.....when you guys scrape together the meagre 45.6 billion dollars required to start up a media machine that will ACTUALLY be as overbearing in the public eye as pop music is, give me a call......i'm terrific with slogans.


even though that's said in jest,......simply flooding the relatively small by comparison dnb scene with enough media to get EVERYONE taking notice and spending coin on your product ALSO costs a fuckload.

certainly WELL beyond the means that any, or all of us combined could supply. otherwise, people would already being doing it. (i know, because i'm one of em!)


the cheap method, unfortunately, is a lot more akin to the scarty methodology if you want to start with no capital, and run a label in the green.




i can always count on you guys for a good spiral of depression as a result of re-assesing these things.

cheers!

i can always count on you guys for a good spiral of depression as a result of re-assesing these things.

cheers!

We need more parties...secret warehouse raves with big rigs...that sort of thing.

Would cheer me up anyway

i can always count on you guys for a good spiral of depression as a result of re-assesing these things.

cheers!

indeed! not going to slow me any though.....i've run at a financial loss on music since i was 15 years old FFS!


a side goal is to earn money from music, but i make it for the love of it, and will continue to do so.

music is the best.


money is crappy, but necessary.

[Statto]

but, a good product wont sell that well with insufficient promotion.
e.g., there's this guy, muttley, bumping "the good shit" on doa but no1 really cares.
sc-vol-1 thread among many many others are bumped to fuck but no1 really cares.

the point about sc was that this was all supposed to be irrelevant
i asked for demand in advance and got 250+ people bigging it up, can't wait to get them, etc., etc.
4 months after pressing and there are still 100+ people defaulting.
so now we're just another label trying to shift units in the mass of other units




big up my main men muttley and dwarde78 anyway

indeed! not going to slow me any though.....i've run at a financial loss on music since i was 15 years old FFS!


a side goal is to earn money from music, but i make it for the love of it, and will continue to do so.

music is the best.


money is crappy, but necessary.

Christ Almighty. If I were a seafaring man I'd have had to send some of you to the fishes long ago to counter the demoralising effect of your endless complaining on the rest of the crew.

Please let's cap the griping that 'the instrumental people in the d+b industry don't do x,y, or z' - we know. Yes, they used to.

But now, they don't.

If you want to continue to try to market your 'drum n bass' at that scene, then deal with that fact, and learn to compromise accordingly.

Once again my question is how 2 get this shit 2 the next level or r we happy where we are???

some ideas that may or may not help

work every angle.

1. be inclusionary instead of exclusionary. dont be elitist within the scene you are trying to promote. dont burn bridges through hatred. promote other parts of the genre you respect and keep your playlists across the board to promote exposure both ways. Code and Cube and ESB & Union and Bassbin crew come to mind in playing across the board and picking the best of all facets of dnb.

2. use your resources. i.e. reach out to people like flight and bailey and other djs who have an audience and have an interest in this small side of the scene. it wont come to you "because the music is just that good." You really have to put out effort. And these people you use dont have to play only what you like as long as they play your shit and belive in what you are doing and you do too.

3. consider cds and mp3s as a main source of output for much or your tunes. ICR - daytrip cd for example (great CD by the way). got his music out on CD regardless and some of the tracks have since made it to vinyl on various labels and more importanlty was another avenue for exposure.

4. make smart decision about the 12s you do release. Breakage and Bassbin etc. do a good job of having one side that has a more mass appeal, without compromising the artists integrity.

5. DIY is fine but dont stop looking for distributors to put in the shops. the average punter you want to turn on to your sound and eventually buy product wont search it out on line for a mail order.

6. Consider tweaking your sound to fit a label you respect but might not otherwise get on. Look at how Paradox released quality tunes on Metalheadz and Dylans label and Hospital, all without compromising his sound. it can be done without selling out. Same with Senses and Equinox on Metalheadz recently. How many more people will listen to their next releases cause they saw heard them on the Metalheadz release. Think globally.

7. as an artist or a record label, consider approaching the "big labels" to develop a distributing relationship or a split series. or even help them develop a sister label that promotes this style of dnb. IF V can do V Liquid, can't they do V Funk, or whatever. Same with BBK or Ram. YOu never know if you dont' ask and help them see there is potential in what you are producing / pushing.

im no expert nor an artist or record label owner, and i know its not that simple but these are just some things that are running through my head. you really, really have to work at it if you want it to work. thats a fact of anything in life.

good advice

in terms of music (musical content, good ideas, variety of tunes) we are on that level already.
it's just the rest that isnt quite on the same level

Once again my question is how 2 get this shit 2 the next level or r we happy where we are???

What do you mean with 'level'?

Once again my question is how 2 get this shit 2 the next level or r we happy where we are???

What do you mean with 'level'?

"next level" something is one of the annoying (post-2000?) dnb-related sayings.
refers to longing for something better.
i hate that expression so much

Once again my question is how 2 get this shit 2 the next level or r we happy where we are???

What do you mean with 'level'?

It's a drum n bass cliche. It can mean whatever you want it to mean.

"next level" something is one of the annoying (post-2000?) dnb-related sayings.

Nah, it's older than that. Has been pretty much drained of all meaning through overuse now though... and like 'Its All Good', it kinda came to stand as a symbol of all that went poxy with the drum n bass scene.

in terms of music (musical content, good ideas, variety of tunes) we are on that level already.

What level?

Maybe there's no next level. Maybe dnb has reached a final state. Maybe we all should format our harddiscs, sell our hardware and do something else. Like pottery. I heard it's absolutely cutting edge.

judging by the way things r going your probably right, it has reached saturation point.

Kinda makes this thread very pointless though



& btw 'Ninth Level' was something I started!

:P

As long as the music (old or new) is continuing to inspire you, it's alive and well


as for the Scene, that's another matter... :P

What level?

a level where good shit is produced